Cheick Kongo latest fighter to leave Juanito Ibarra
September 15, 2008 by Sam Caplan
Juanito Ibarra, a converted boxing trainer that at one time could boast working with the likes of Quinton “Rampage” Jackson and Michael Bisping, has lost yet another fighter.
Published reports indicate that UFC heavyweight Cheick Kongo has left Ibarra in order to join Jackson and Bisping at the Wolfslair MMA Academy in Liverpool, England.
Ibarra had been Jackson’s trainer and manager but was relieved of his duties following Jackson’s upset loss to Forrest Griffin at UFC 86 in July.
Jackson has not publicly addressed the reasons for his decision to part ways with Ibarra, but former UFC light heavyweight champion Tito Ortiz recently accused Ibarra of overcharging Jackson to run his training camps.
“Let me explain this to you because it really pisses me off that Ibarra has done what he has done, he is a thief,” Ortiz told FiveOuncesOfPain.com and PunchDrunkGamer.com’s Dave Carpinello. “I have been running training camps for seven years up in Big Bear California and the most that my camp has cost a fighter to attend is $35,000. Ibarra was charging Jackson $65,000 to go to Big Bear. I don’t understand that! He was being very disrespectful and taking advantage of Rampage. Including travel, training partners, food and lodging, the most ever was $35,000, maybe if you flew in more trainers… 40K. Where did that extra money go that Ibarra was charging?”
According to Ortiz, Ibarra has been blackballed from the MMA industry for his alleged actions.
Isnt this the same story as Cheick Kongo joining Wolfslair?
Ibarra is getting a bad rep fast. That sucks for him.
[...] “Let me explain this to you because it really pisses me off that Ibarra has done what he has done, he is a thief. I have been running training camps for seven years up in Big Bear California and the most that my camp has cost a fighter to attend is $35,000. Ibarra was charging Jackson $65,000 to go to Big Bear. I don’t understand that! He was being very disrespectful and taking advantage of Rampage. Including travel, training partners, food and lodging, the most ever was $35,000, maybe if you flew in more trainers… 40K. Where did that extra money go that Ibarra was charging?” - Tito Ortiz till fiveouncesofpain [...]
Did they not know what Ibarras fees were prior to hiring him? Isnt this one reason why fighters have managers? I fail to see the reason for resentment.
I’ve got to agree.. it stands to reason that the fighters HAVE to have known what they were paying to get into his camp. It isn’t like Jackson was only with him for a few months either, they’ve been together for quite some time. I’d love to hear what the real reason for this exodus of fighters is, but it sure seems like Juanito isn’t going to have the same cash flow with those two (and what may be more) fighters leaving.
As for Ortiz, it’s hard to take anything he says as fact anymore. Tito Ortiz is only really interested in Tito Ortiz’s best interests. Just this quote from him tells me that he’s trying to get people away from Juanito into his camp, promising them a half-price camp.
Neil and drdsanders, of course Page knew what Ibarra was charging him. Tito’s point was that Ibarra charges far above the going rate for his training camps. Now whether Tito is correct about that, who knows, but he wasn’t trying to say that Ibarra did some kind of bait and switch. Just that he charges too much to begin with.
So what does this say about Wolfslair?
Did they suddenly hire a bunch of talented coaches and get an even better stable of fighters for these very well known fighters to train with?
I can see Congo’s reasoning behind joining them purely on geographical terms, but Rampage? Would he just not have fitted in at another US based mega-team?
This can only be good for the lesser known English fighters from that camp.
It’s hard to determine the real reasoning but sometimes the best charge the most. However, it’s hard to even determine if Ibarra is the best? The discrepency in price difference is huge but I do agree that fighters should have an idea of training costs.
Wasn’t Juanito Rampage’s manager as well? If so, that’s pretty dastardly, getting your cut on the purses, contracts and sponsorships. Then fleecing him on the training cost!
What a guy!
Juanito is done, does anyone think he can bounce back from this one?
I personally think he wont be able to. Anyone who trains with him from here on will be blackballed as well.
Who cares what Tito has to say about his training camps? What good have they done him lately? How about the fighters he’s trained up there? Who are they, and how have they done? If something is crap, it’s still crap even if the price is low.
based on Rampages fights before/after training with Juanito , i’d say J’ s a great trainer for those who need to improve their hands/footwork/boxing skills.
wouldn’t be the first ripoff in the name of Jesus.
i’d like to hear Juanito’s side of the story.
# Mike Wolfe on September 15th, 2008 4:41 pm
Who cares what Tito has to say about his training camps? What good have they done him lately? How about the fighters he’s trained up there? Who are they, and how have they done? If something is crap, it’s still crap even if the price is low.
It’s somewhat relevant because he actually used to train Rampage. Other fighters he’s trained up there include Razor Rob McCullough, Josh Burkman, Matt Hamill, Tiki, Kendall Grove, Melvin Guillard, Ricco Rodriguez, Justin McCully all trained under him as part of Team Punishment. There are others have trained with him for single fights here and there, I know. One could argue that part of Tito’s slide has been that he’s become more of a trainer than a fighter over the last few years.
Yikes. Sorry for the wacky sentence construction and random missing words, but I think the gist is still intact.
I wouldn’t read into this too much. Kongo basically just moved stateside recently from France, so I’d imagine this might make more sense to him. Anything else is just speculation and heresay. UFC has basically created a European division anyways, so I wonder if Rampage and Kongo are going to go that route. Who does Wolfslair have for BJJ trainers anyway? Not just Ian Freeman, I hope.
so what juanito wants to make money. we all want to make money. he obviously is sought to be a great trainer training bigger named fighters. it’s like “hey the fighters are making more money now…. why don’t i?” there has to be more to it then just that i would think. i’d love to hear juanito’s side of the story. it’s easy to side with a fighter people love rather then a corner man/trainer/manager that is more behind the scenes on things so to speak.. win or lose you couldn’t say rampage or even kongo isn’t making enough money to support their family and pay their trainers ect. and have money on side to just blow on whatever they want. i mean how many people do you know that makes 500K (thats minus all sponsors/commercial work) a year? most people don’t even make a tenth of that. there is alot of time invested in training fighters and alot of long days included. think about it logically. put yourself in his shoes.
Yeah I want to her Juanito’s side of it because they were having a love affair on TUF. Talking about how both have been screwed and found each other and everything has been great. Obviously Juanito focused only on Rampage’s boxing after the Henderson fight because he didnt use it at all against the LHW CHAMP Forrest Griffin. Awww that fills so good to say I will say it again…LHW CHAMP Forrest Griffing.
Making a big change like that after losing the title to such good competition is crazy, something else had to happen, did you notice the tension in Kongo and Juanito during Kongos last fight.. I didnt,,,,,
Juanito’s problem stems from him selling himself as the “Special trainer” that will make you win. As such, he surely thought he had what it would take to charge more from his trainees. But, when Rampage lost to Forrest, it did beg the question “What was I paying so much for?” If quality is not delivered, then it does not take much for a person to begin questioning the “product”.
Had Rampage won against Griffin, we would not even be reading about fighters leaving his camp. He would probably be signing even more fighters.
Sam, do you know what other fighters currently train with Ibarra? It would be interesting to know who hasn’t left…at least not yet.
Hex–
At the risk of sounding snotty, none of those fighters are settting the world on fire, and neither is Tito. Rampage’s loss to Forrest was a tough one, but that doesn’t mean that Juanito screwed up somehow. Lots of people on this site thought Rampage won it. Rampage seemed a little flat during that fight for whatever reason. I’d like to hear both sides of the story from the men involved–Juanito and Rampage–not second hand editorializing from Tito.