Comments on: PRIDE’s Brazilian Super Heroes Appear to Have Lost their Special Powers http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/ Your Destination for Insider MMA News and Opinion Sun, 22 Nov 2009 15:53:17 -0600 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: s00nertp http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-62272 s00nertp Thu, 01 Jan 2009 00:38:03 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-62272 well, I was just giving the example of one weight class for 1,2,3. In 4, I opened it up to all weight classes and listed a few obvious choices. You are right though BJ Penn is another example of a fighter who has it all. well, I was just giving the example of one weight class for 1,2,3.

In 4, I opened it up to all weight classes and listed a few obvious choices.

You are right though BJ Penn is another example of a fighter who has it all.

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]]> By: yourmomma http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-62191 yourmomma Wed, 31 Dec 2008 04:06:29 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-62191 Game planning game planning GAME PLANNING.. s00nertp BJ Penn should be added into your 2nd,3rd, and 4th. How can you leave him out? Game planning game planning GAME PLANNING..

s00nertp BJ Penn should be added into your 2nd,3rd, and 4th.

How can you leave him out?

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]]> By: s00nertp http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-62151 s00nertp Tue, 30 Dec 2008 23:21:07 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-62151 Sam, This article was brilliant, I wish I could have articulated my feelings as well as you did. Every point you made was right next to my heart. Wanderlei and Nogueria were 2 of the first fighters I saw that dazzled & amazed me, though for different reasons. They were very much similar to how others feel about Michael Jordan for me. Sure I admired Gracie, and the old school UFC originals.. but these were the brilliant new 3rd generation fighters that defined the sport for me. Thank you, I appreciate how you honored their legacy and voiced my feelings. (I believe there are 4 generations of fighters: 1) Gracie, the JJ generation. He proved you needed a ground game (either JJ defense or JJ skills) to win. 2) Sakuraba, JJ/Standup. He proved you needed ground + standup. 3) Wanderlei, Muay Thai. He proved it was most effective with ground game, standup, and Muay Thai combos. 4) Miguel Torres, GSP, Anderson Silva, Urijah Faber. They have it all: JJ (not just ground defense), standup combos, vicious Muay Thai.) You dont need to be 4th generation to win, but those are the Michael Jordans of MMA. Sure 2nd generation fighters like Rashad will win and move up, but that is not what I love. I love the 4th generation wizards that can do it all. Nogueria to me was an unusual 3rd generation fighter with the best defensive technique against standup & Muay Thai. Sam,
This article was brilliant, I wish I could have articulated my feelings as well as you did.

Every point you made was right next to my heart. Wanderlei and Nogueria were 2 of the first fighters I saw that dazzled & amazed me, though for different reasons. They were very much similar to how others feel about Michael Jordan for me. Sure I admired Gracie, and the old school UFC originals.. but these were the brilliant new 3rd generation fighters that defined the sport for me.

Thank you, I appreciate how you honored their legacy and voiced my feelings.

(I believe there are 4 generations of fighters:
1) Gracie, the JJ generation. He proved you needed a ground game (either JJ defense or JJ skills) to win.
2) Sakuraba, JJ/Standup. He proved you needed ground + standup.
3) Wanderlei, Muay Thai. He proved it was most effective with ground game, standup, and Muay Thai combos.
4) Miguel Torres, GSP, Anderson Silva, Urijah Faber. They have it all: JJ (not just ground defense), standup combos, vicious Muay Thai.)

You dont need to be 4th generation to win, but those are the Michael Jordans of MMA. Sure 2nd generation fighters like Rashad will win and move up, but that is not what I love. I love the 4th generation wizards that can do it all.

Nogueria to me was an unusual 3rd generation fighter with the best defensive technique against standup & Muay Thai.

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]]> By: ultmma http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61997 ultmma Tue, 30 Dec 2008 03:30:12 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61997 Age catches up with all great athletes. These two have been through nothing but wars in their career. This isn't a Pride vs. UFC thing lol with the explicative cares any more Nog needs to fighting in the low 230s for him to be successful and Wandy needs to drop down to 185 or become a gate keeper for 205 a la Tito Ortiz with his fights versus Forrest, Rashad and Machida in 06-07 Age catches up with all great athletes. These two have been through nothing but wars in their career.

This isn’t a Pride vs. UFC thing lol with the explicative cares any more

Nog needs to fighting in the low 230s for him to be successful and Wandy needs to drop down to 185 or become a gate keeper for 205 a la Tito Ortiz with his fights versus Forrest, Rashad and Machida in 06-07

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]]> By: jimbo http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61959 jimbo Mon, 29 Dec 2008 21:27:52 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61959 The Pride drug polices / difference in striking rules are certainly valid points. I dont believe its a age thing for Nog and Wand as much as they have been fighting for so long. Really it just wasnot either of thier nights. Wand got caught and id love to see a rematch at the end of 09. Also Nog vs Coture & maybe Wand vs Franklin or Chuck need to happen in 09 !!! The Pride drug polices / difference in striking rules are certainly valid points.
I dont believe its a age thing for Nog and Wand as much as they have been fighting for so long. Really it just wasnot either of thier nights. Wand got caught and id love to see a rematch at the end of 09. Also Nog vs Coture & maybe Wand vs Franklin or Chuck need to happen in 09 !!!

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]]> By: john http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61926 john Mon, 29 Dec 2008 18:50:11 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61926 the way i see it is, randy,chuck,hughes,wandy,nog,tito,ken shamrock, frank shamrock,coleman,randleman, severn, royse gracie, basically all the idols of the past should retire, and then bammmmmm, bring them all back for one card and i guarantee the biggest buy of all times, make it happen dana the way i see it is, randy,chuck,hughes,wandy,nog,tito,ken shamrock, frank shamrock,coleman,randleman, severn, royse gracie, basically all the idols of the past should retire, and then bammmmmm, bring them all back for one card and i guarantee the biggest buy of all times, make it happen dana

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]]> By: Davey D http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61922 Davey D Mon, 29 Dec 2008 18:39:27 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61922 One thing Pride FC did for me was make me realize just how big this sport can become. PRIDE filled super area's in Japan with 50,000 plus on the regular. Even though it was just Japan. Attendence like that is amazing. The two show's in the US were excellent as well. Furthermore, the game was played far different than that in the Octagon. The UFC is now the one to carry MMA and showcase it at the highest level. The game might be played different in many places but the Octagon is where best compete today. All road's lead there to reign supreme (with Fedor as an exception, even he should join). One thing Pride FC did for me was make me realize just how big this sport can become. PRIDE filled super area’s in Japan with 50,000 plus on the regular. Even though it was just Japan. Attendence like that is amazing. The two show’s in the US were excellent as well.

Furthermore, the game was played far different than that in the Octagon. The UFC is now the one to carry MMA and showcase it at the highest level. The game might be played different in many places but the Octagon is where best compete today. All road’s lead there to reign supreme (with Fedor as an exception, even he should join).

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]]> By: JJ Docker http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61915 JJ Docker Mon, 29 Dec 2008 18:20:10 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61915 I agree with Imbecile. It may be pedantic but I'll put it out there that if you don't know that Dana's surname is spelt White and not 'Wight', you won't really know too much about MMA, let alone the UFC. And in response to your point, records have little to do with how talented a fighter is. Randy doesn't have the best record statistically but that's because he's spent most of his career fighting great fighters and/or champions of the sport. Comparing records is an inaccurate and definitely moronic way of deciding who are the better fighters. I agree with Imbecile. It may be pedantic but I’ll put it out there that if you don’t know that Dana’s surname is spelt White and not ‘Wight’, you won’t really know too much about MMA, let alone the UFC.
And in response to your point, records have little to do with how talented a fighter is. Randy doesn’t have the best record statistically but that’s because he’s spent most of his career fighting great fighters and/or champions of the sport. Comparing records is an inaccurate and definitely moronic way of deciding who are the better fighters.

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]]> By: Imbecile http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61908 Imbecile Mon, 29 Dec 2008 17:53:08 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61908 Sam, I share yoru sentiment on both Wandy and Nogueira. But for me, it is beyond just Pride fighters, but the fall of the whole generation of fighters that really built the sport into the mainstream. Chuck Liddell has lost a step or two. Wandy looks like a shell of his former self, and no longer ripples with muscles or fights with the fury he once did. Nogueira looks like the wars he has put his body through have finally caught up with him, as he moves very slowly and looked like he saw none of the punches coming in. Matt Hughes looks barely interested in the sport, and for a guy who was so dominatingly powerful for so many years, he looked small and weak compared to Alves. CroCop is already nearly two years into a complete free-fall of his career, and it is hard to explain to new fans exactly how frightening a fighter he really was at one time. Randy Couture... well, surprisingly the oldest of this bunch may have the most left in him, but his time is running out and Lesnar presents an obstacle that may just have been too great for The Natural. Just like it was sad to see Jordan in his final comeback, when he wasn't the dominant player he once was, it is sad to see this old guard getting outclassed by the new young guns. It is exciting for the new fighters, but for those of us that watched these guys grow up and now fade out in the sport, it is a bit of a sad thing. I will always love Nogueira vs. Sapp, Couture vs. Rizzo, Hughes vs. Newton, Wandy vs. Sakuraba, and all of those key fights that helped make this sport what it is. @ ape - I guess no matter what the topic, there is some moron on here that either loves or hates Dana White so much they make everything about him. For the record, it was only a few months ago that everyone was all over White for over-hyping Anderson Silva, and now, according to you, he promotes Lesnar while ignoring Silva? He also said it was his most exciting moment as UFC President to get Wanderlei Silva in the UFC. So much for your assessment that he hates all former Pride fighters. You sir, are a complete moron. Sam, I share yoru sentiment on both Wandy and Nogueira. But for me, it is beyond just Pride fighters, but the fall of the whole generation of fighters that really built the sport into the mainstream. Chuck Liddell has lost a step or two. Wandy looks like a shell of his former self, and no longer ripples with muscles or fights with the fury he once did. Nogueira looks like the wars he has put his body through have finally caught up with him, as he moves very slowly and looked like he saw none of the punches coming in. Matt Hughes looks barely interested in the sport, and for a guy who was so dominatingly powerful for so many years, he looked small and weak compared to Alves. CroCop is already nearly two years into a complete free-fall of his career, and it is hard to explain to new fans exactly how frightening a fighter he really was at one time. Randy Couture… well, surprisingly the oldest of this bunch may have the most left in him, but his time is running out and Lesnar presents an obstacle that may just have been too great for The Natural.

Just like it was sad to see Jordan in his final comeback, when he wasn’t the dominant player he once was, it is sad to see this old guard getting outclassed by the new young guns. It is exciting for the new fighters, but for those of us that watched these guys grow up and now fade out in the sport, it is a bit of a sad thing. I will always love Nogueira vs. Sapp, Couture vs. Rizzo, Hughes vs. Newton, Wandy vs. Sakuraba, and all of those key fights that helped make this sport what it is.

@ ape – I guess no matter what the topic, there is some moron on here that either loves or hates Dana White so much they make everything about him. For the record, it was only a few months ago that everyone was all over White for over-hyping Anderson Silva, and now, according to you, he promotes Lesnar while ignoring Silva? He also said it was his most exciting moment as UFC President to get Wanderlei Silva in the UFC. So much for your assessment that he hates all former Pride fighters. You sir, are a complete moron.

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]]> By: ape http://fiveouncesofpain.com/2008/12/28/prides-brazilian-super-heroes-appear-to-have-lost-their-special-powers/comment-page-1/#comment-61874 ape Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:53:50 +0000 http://fiveouncesofpain.com/?p=10444#comment-61874 That is B S! I guess if your not kissing Dana Wight's A$$ your not a good fighter in his eyes! Nogueira is 31-4 Wanderlei is 32-8 Liddell is only 21-5 Quinton 28-7 Now you tell me whow is the better fighters. Let me tell you one more thing about Mr. Dana Wight I have seen he hates everyone form PRIDE except for his puppet Quinton. He talks more about Brock than he dose Anderson Silva. Nogeira & Wanderlei are two of many that still Respected, Skilled and Entertaining fighters in MMA. That is B S! I guess if your not kissing Dana Wight’s A$$ your not a good fighter in his eyes!
Nogueira is 31-4
Wanderlei is 32-8
Liddell is only 21-5
Quinton 28-7
Now you tell me whow is the better fighters.
Let me tell you one more thing about Mr. Dana Wight I have seen he hates everyone form PRIDE except for his puppet Quinton. He talks more about Brock
than he dose Anderson Silva.
Nogeira & Wanderlei are two of many that still Respected, Skilled and Entertaining fighters in MMA.

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