Lyoto Machida: ‘I put [Shogun] in danger three or four times’
After having a chance to review his highly scrutinized performance this past Saturday night against Mauricio “Shogun” Rua at UFC 104, Lyoto Machida is more convinced than ever before that the the verdict rendered by the judges in his favor was the correct one.
In a recent conversation with Sherdog.com the UFC light heavyweight title holder had this to say, “I had the opportunity to see the fight again and I thought I won four rounds and Shogun took the last one. Some people say he won the fourth and fifth round, but for sure I won at least the first three rounds.”
The reason for all of the controversy is simple according to “The Dragon”: Favoritism by Rogan and Goldie.
Never mind the fact that the bulk of the crowd in attendance was jeering the decision once it was rendered; They must have overheard the slanted commentary as well.
“The American commentators were pretty much biased,” explained away the fighter formerly known as the least hit fighter in the history of the UFC. “If you see the fight without audio, you will probably see a different fight.”
I guess us simple minded Americans can be easily swayed by what we hear during the broadcast of a fight. It’s almost as if Rogan and Goldberg must have been sending out subliminal signals to brainwash all of us sheep that have such a hard time thinking for ourselves.
Disregard the fact that Rua clearly landed more of the strikes during the bout by a wide margin, to be the champ you have to beat the champ, right?
“Shogun was a great opponent and had a nice strategy,” said Lyoto. “He deserves all my respect as a fighter, but I was superior.”
“I had three or four chances to finish the fight, and he never put me in danger. I didn’t get (dazed) at any moment of the fight, but I put him in danger three or four times. He kicked my legs a couple of times, but he wouldn’t knock me out with that. This fight was judged by professionals, so I’m pretty much comfortable with the result.”
Cory Brady is the managing editor of FiveOuncesOfPain.com.
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One observation: the two hardest shots I saw in the Rua/Machida fight were one of the knees Lyoto threw in round one, and one of the flurry of shots he threw in round three. Yes, Shogun hit Machida harder and more often than anyone since BJ Penn, and I’ll look forward to more of that in their second encounter…
Well-Done.
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Well-Done.
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granted i wasn’t there – i’m not a judge, and i’m not even a professional fighter… but that’s my opinion. and i’m sticking to it.
you had “three or four chances to end the fight”? then why didn’t you Lyoto? he kicked my legs “a couple of times?” maybe 48 out of 68 (fightmetric.com) counts as “a couple” in Brazil, but not here.
i understand that Lyoto has to back up the decision – after all he can’t go around saying he lost the fight. but i believe he knows the truth – look at his face in the octagon after the fight and before the decision. not the expression of a man who feels like he was victorious.
but really – it’s irrelevant what Machida believes – or for that matter, what Shogun believes – the real question is this: what are we as the fans going to *do* about this??
in my opinion – this decision should be appealed, the fight results should be annulled – declared void and null, and not a single one of those judges should ever be allowed to judge so much as a high school lunch-room fight.
so who do we call/write? the CSAC? how do we petition them? who’s going to organize the campaign? i’d love to but full load of school + work doesn’t leave much time… willing to help tho. anyone able to step up?
this is a call to arms! let’s keep these idiots from ruining our sport. we’ve had to work hard enough to get it to the point it is today, i’m not willing to let these fools turn it into bloodless, soulless, Olympic style “Karate” (where the “fighters” get points for their lighting fast strikes but lose points if they actually inflict damage on their opponent) or Boxing or even Kickboxing.
it’s not a coincidence that MMA is at the moment bigger here in the US than all three of those sports *combined*.
how long do you think it’ll stay that way if these morons have they’re way?
ok – rant over.
bennett
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Hot debate. What do you think?
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I never liked Machida much, but now I’m actually losing all the respect I had for him.
In the end, Shogun is the real winner. not only did he win the fight in the public’s opinion, but he’s coming out as the hero of this whole thing, and Machida is looking more and more like a villain. I just hope he whips Lyoto’s ass in the rematch. I´m glad he’s back for real!
I’d also like to hear Rogan’s commentary on this.
Cheers from Chile!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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By the way after watching this fight several times now I think that Rogan and Goldie were very accurate with their calling of the fight. On times when they applauded Shogun for a hard kick when it looked like Machida threw high, it was obvious he didn’t connect at all as he hit Shogun’s elbow a couple times and a couple times Shogun blocked them.
I’m embarrassed for people who admit that they were swayed by the commentary, are you guys children? Seriously do you watch the fight or close your eyes and listen to audio?
This fight was what it was, and the outcome was theft.
Now I’m reading on all sorts of sites that Machida’s going to destroy Shogun next fight now. Really, based on what?
Even if we believe that Machida connected with his barrage on Shogun in the third (which he clearly didn’t), well all that proves is that Machida is incapable of hurting Shogun as he wasn’t even close to being phased or staggered.
Sorry Lyoto, I know you need to save face but I don’t have a clue what you saw in your fight that leads you to believe you had him hurt at least four times. I guess it was a Machida charity case that he decided to let Shogun stay conscious then, what a crock.
Well-Done.
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Well-Done.
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Well-Done.
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Well-Done.
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When i wrote about the second fight I said I thought Machida would come back with a dominating performance because he would realize he lost the fight. This now effectively changes my mind to a degree. If he doesnt realize he needs to mix in some takedowns and fight a different fight he will lose. I ask when did you have him stunned let a lone in danger? Do you think when you threw that flurry in round 3 when you hit him with one good pucnh to start than pretty much missed him with 3 or 4 others(than he rocked you with a right hook). Or in the first round when you caught him good then hit him with some good knees to the body. How is that anymore danger than getting slammed with body kicks and leg kicks?
I will no longer be rooting for you Machida. I hope you know with this attitude your going to lose even more fans that you lost during the fight. You lost the goddamn Match, accept it and make the neccesary changes.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Kevin Iole reported that Shoguns corner was at fault for telling their fighter he was ahead on the score cards.
Lyotos corner were saying the entire fight “youve got him”, “you’re winning the fight”. Where is Anderson or his brother smacking some since into him? Where is a good corner man telling him to wait for a kick to go for a takedown? Where is somebody who is actually watching the fight? How would either corner think after rounds 1-3 that either fighters were way ahead on the score cards? They were all close as shit!
Well-Done.
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Weak-Sauce.
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Griffin did win by leg kick. I was there.(Although I thought that fight was a draw)….
What fight were you watching?
Hot debate. What do you think?
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If I recall correctly, Everyone thought that Rampage won the fight with Griffin, me included, but Forrest was given the decision based on leg kicks alone. Perhaps the judges realized after the fact they were wrong on that one, and judges now are leery of repeating that same mistake. However, after watching the fight a number of times, I give Lyoto Rounds 1 and 3, with Shogun taking 2 and four. All of the first rounds were incredibly close, but there is no doubt that Shogun decisively took round 5 which should have been the deciding factor in the judges mind. I may would even have dubbed round 5 a 10-8 round in Shoguns favor. How many times have we seen a fighter win rounds 1 and 2 on points, and then the other fighter takes control in the last round – enough to sway the decision in their favor, despite losing the other rounds? It has happened repeatedly. With four rather close rounds, and 1 (the last) being completely lop-sided, it makes perfect sense that Shogun would have been granted the decision. But it didnt happen that way.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Hot debate. What do you think?
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danger of what?
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that is all i have to say
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Hot debate. What do you think?
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that is all i have to say”
I’m embarrassed for you any anyone else that saw two different fights when they listened to audio and without.
Are you telling everyone here you parrot everything you hear? Can you not discern what’s actually happening regardless of what the announcers are saying?
That’s just weak, sorry man the fight was called correctly and Machida was given credit the few times he actually earned it in the fight. Honestly you guys with this audio thing are beyond belief.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Fight ending was wrong man, but Rogan didnt help it out at all. There were three seperate times I remember in the first two rounds that Machida countered a kick with a punch to the face and all Rogan could talk about was the kick. I remember because i called Rogan out all three times he did it to my friends.
Alot of the mainstream fans have nothing else to go by than rogans word. Thats why you are slowly starting to see guys go on these blogging sites and realize it was not as lopsided as everyone thinks….
SHOGUN WAS STILL NEVER IN DANGER.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Oh, OK! what a great idea! always KO or sub your opponent, why hasnt anyone ever thought of THAT before?!!!
[/sarcasm]
i also hate the idiotic idea that you somehow have to dominate a champion to beat him. when you fight better than your opponent and do more damage you win, period.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Now, there is a problem with a rematch here. Not because I don’t want to see it, but because it shouldn’t be happening to begin with, seeing as how Shogun should already have the belt. He was cheated out of the belt and has a loss on his record that should not be there.
Shogun already has more to lose in the rematch than Machida. If he “loses” again, then that will be two losses on his record that should not exist. If Lyoto loses then he can say they need a rubber match to settle the score. Shogun is in a must win situation. Even though he just won! It’s bullshit.
Does anyone agree ?
P.S. Proof that Machida knows he lost—-the fact that he had to rewatch the fight to try and prove to himself he won!
Hot debate. What do you think?
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@cocoonofhorror- Yeah I completely agree. Why should the judges have to favor the champion?
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Well-Done.
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>”parrot”?
yes for sure people on the internets are 14 y.o. idiots. we all know that. I think we established that long ago. present company excluded lol.
in any case, psychology proves that if people tell you something enough times, even if you don’t agree, you’ll start to be convinced. no one knows that better than advertisers. to deny any “Rogan effect” at all and pretend to be above all influence is to ignore what we know from these experts. I had to shut the sound off, the guy’s commentating is just so useless. and he probably had me thinking Rua did better in rds 1 – 3 than I now think, until I rewatched several times with no sound.
all that said, assume for a moment this board is in fact the best mma board around (I think so lol). take what mu_shin says here:
that argues heavily in favor Machida won 1 and 3.
We can for the sake of argument say Rua won 4 and 5 b/c even Machida is willing to conceded that.
So, logically, the only round worth arguing about is rd 2. In this rd, Rua tried to land leg kicks, most of which were evaded or countered, was able to hold Machida against the fence and throw some knees. Machida knocked Rua off balance twice (gets more “control” points in my book from a judo bias, maybe not everyone’s book), stuffed 2 takedowns (2:55 and 1:26 to go), threw a good knee to the body, then from the clinch threw a knee and some shin kicks. Does anyone really dispute this account? (Where TF does this supposed fightmetric site get its stats btw?)
If not, you are scoring either the holding against the fence or the attempted leg kicks more (”aggression”?) than I am. How much are attempted leg kicks, and leg kicks really worth? Muay thai rules say limb strikes are not scored if in defense – what does that mean? Ok as offense? If they count more than I thought, the scoring needs to change. I do not want to watch matches involving mainly holding and leg kicks.
Booing: I would boo, too, considering the lack of action from two such acclaimed fighters. Especially when they were clinched but neither was doing anything. I don’t think we can read much into the crowd when it chanted for Machida early, and then switched to Shogun late. My take is the crowd just wanted to see some definitive finish and was frustrated with lack of action.
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Dude your gonna drive yourself crazy explaining this over and over.
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As an example I watched the Sexyyama vs Belcher fight (with audio as per usual) and I saw clearly that Sexyama won that fight hands down, full marks to Belcher for a good fight though.
I also have sat around and heard about global warming for years with everyone around me screaming “The world is melting”. I’ve never believed it for so much as one minute and now there’s mountains, upon mountains of evidence that it’s a crock of shit.
My point is that I believe myself and what I observe, I can’t think of one case where I’ve been swayed by someone being passionate about something that I happen to be observing at the same time. Maybe that doesn’t go for everyone, but I find that sad.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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I dont think i have EVER been swayed by what commentators have said… and i honestly dont know how i could ever be. Infact i dont know how anybody could be. I watch a fight, i dont listen to it lol. Rogan did his job and commentated. I think he was not biased. He simply commentated on what he saw. It was very difficult to see those counter punches when you watched it live. Do you want to know why that was though? Because they rarely ever landed cleanly. Most were blocked lol. So you can understand why Rogan highlighted the leg kicks… because they did more damage. Do i think he concentrated more on what Shogun did? Yes, in parts, because i think Shogun did alot more. So i think his commentating was good, as it usually is.
I think people are using excuses as to why so many people are saying Shogun won. You are forgetting that alot of people watch the fight with groups of people… and i dont know if anyone is used to that, but its very difficult to listen to what the commentators are saying when your with all your friends. Also, i guarentee that MMA analysts are swayed by the commentating, they ‘judge’ what they see in the fight. I honestly cant believe people are blaming Rogan for ‘brainwashing’ people haha. If Derren Brown was commentating… yeh id be more suspicious. But Rogan lol. He is very knowledgeable of MMA, and does a great job analysing fights. IF im correct, didnt he have Machida to win? And actually during the fight, i thought he made it sound like it was alot closer than i initially thought it was.
After rewatching the fight several times, it was closer than i initially expected. I watched it without sound… just to see if it really did make a difference haha (but it didnt). And my judgement is still the same, i scored it 48-47 Rua, every single time. I can see where Round 1 could have gone either way, but i think Rua edged the win. Machida won rounds 2 and 3. Rua, 1, 4 and 5. The commentating most definetly didnt change my opinion of the fight lol.
And the fact that Machida said that aswell… wow… i didnt think he would stoop that low lol. Maybe he is more arrogant than i thought … Hmm, na, ill put it down to bad translations from Ed Soares (as he has a bad habit of changing alot of what he is translating lol).
Oh and ill add… when i was watching it live.. i was screaming at Rogan for making it sound far to even come the end. I was like!! ‘wht do you mean it could go either way!!!!’ ‘ no fucking way man!!! Shogun definetly won that!!!’ ‘Rogan…. you make it sound like Machida has a chance of winning!!! Shogun won that definetly!!!’
I honestly thought Rogan made it sound very very even. Not one sided at all.
Ahwell lol, we will get to see the much needed rematch (to sort these debates out lol). And hopefully in finishes with a more decisive ending this time!!!
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Lol error there ‘ i guarentee MMA analysts are NOT swayed by the commentators..’
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lol you’re right. i’m going with the theory of “say it 7 times and it starts to sink in” (another tactic in advertising) … sooner or later I’ll convince even Niv (who is impervious to persuasion) to at least consider my argument …
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neija “lol you’re right. i’m going with the theory of “say it 7 times and it starts to sink in” (another tactic in advertising) … sooner or later I’ll convince even Niv (who is impervious to persuasion) to at least consider my argument … ”
Hey i appreciate the banter, who knows maybe one day I’ll see your argument or you may sway me, but it definitely won’t be on this topic.
Take care
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Everyone is trying to say that Machida did more damage and landed more hard shots. Is everyone aware that Machida was issued a 60 day no contact suspension due to injuries suffered in this fight, while the loser Shogun was issued no suspension.
Just one last nail in the coffin of this debate as far as I’m concerned.
Hot debate. What do you think?
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Weak-Sauce.
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you’re right. it doesn’t budge me either. we’ll have to agree to disagree and i jointly tap out after this one, too.
IF we were the judges, and we judged the total fight not rounds, and we knew who got a suspension to factor into that, we could use all that information to rule in favor of shogun. if we have to score round by round (the case here – for better or for worse), the suspension is information not factored in or even available at the time of judging, and I think we basically slightly differ on our views of the early rds.
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Lyoto, I don’t know how you passed the drug test. I’ve been one of your biggest defenders this week, but your crazy if you think Shogun was ever in position to be finished. Neither one of you were close. He was never wobbled, dazed, down, or anything else that might be close to being finished.
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“I had three or four chances to finish the fight…”
My question is simply, When?
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